I have an on line book but it's not about Bethel. It is call "The Persistent Illusion" it will be on kindle by the end of this week.
new boy
JoinedPosts by new boy
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24
My Bthel Experince Part 19 The Last Chapter..(really) Bethel Overseers
by new boy inthere were other people who either killed themselves or tried to kill themselves while they were at "the house of god.
one person who did kill himself was richard wheelock, press room overseer ......he jumped out of a window at the watchtower farm one day.
it seemed, he was never quite the same after his wife "willy" died.
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was Darwin an atheist?
by Ruby456 inasking this q because my own feeling about this is that he probably believed in god but his evolutionary thesis is used to support atheism.
how come?
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new boy
Well, good question
I was in London in 1988 on a tour. We went to West Minister Abby.
Guess who is buried "inside" the church? Charles Darwin. I asked the tour guide about that. She said Charles was a church member in good standing.
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The WT in 10 years time
by Coded Logic ina. in 2026 in what state do you think the organization will be?.
) 9million + members.
) roughly the same amount of members as today (7-9 million)..
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new boy
They're not going away.
As long as witnesses are having sex with other witnesses they will keep growing.
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My life After Bethel Part 1
by new boy inthe day i left it was pouring rain........i really screwed up, i found out the night before, as i was packing things up, that i had way under estimated how much stuff i had.
i had two large suit cases (that i could barely shut the lids on) and a large army duffel bag.
i would guess about 200 pounds of shit......my van was in rhode island with the engine out of it.
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new boy
The day I left it was pouring rain........I really screwed up, I found out the night before, as I was packing things up, that I had way under estimated how much stuff I had. I had two large suit cases (that I could barely shut the lids on) and a large army duffel bag. I would guess about 200 pounds of shit......My Van was in Rhode Island with the engine out of it. I was taking the bus to my new "home".........It was only 4 blocks to the Subway station. It took me 45 minutes to get there.......the longest 45 minutes of my life. It looked like something out of "The Shawshank Redemption" when he crash out of prison in the rain. I would carry or drag my belongings only about 30-40 feet at a time.........I would have to stop.......I would sit there on top of one of my suit cases, panting for air. I was drenched and mad as hell........How could I have been so stupid. After a few minutes, I would gather my strength and drag my shit another 50-75 ft. People looking at me as they were walking by....sitting there in the rain............What a sight.......but in New York City, most people are not surprised at anything, they may see around the next corner.
There was no “Brother can we give you a ride to the airport or bus station.” You left the same way you came alone.
I missed my first bus to Rhode Island and had to wait 4 hours for the next bus. So I was pissed off at everything, Bethel, New York City, the subways and life in general. As I sat there drench to the bone with everything I owned. I thought about how I got screwed the first day I came to Bethel too. I took a cab from the airport back in 1970. I should have been about a 20 minute cab ride. My cab driver asked if I was "new" to the area..........I said "Yes, I was......I'm going to 124 Columbia Heights the world headquarters of the Jehovah's Witness!" as if he really cared. Little did I know he was going to give me a full tour of all Brooklyn...........over an hour later he dropped me off at the 124 building, he said "That will be $52.50" he gave me my bags and as I walking away......when he said "Hey kid....what about a tip?" It was the first cab ride in my life and didn't know how it all worked, so I gave him another 5 bucks....."Thanks" he said and "Welcome to New York!"......I only had 140 dollars to my name after the cab ride. Now, I was leaving Bethel with $160 bucks.........not bad......after 4 years I leave with a $20 profit. I guess I got screwed coming and going...........but I can't blame anyone put myself. I don't mind making mistakes, I just hate making the same ones, over again.
On leaving Bethel I made two Vows.
1. I would NEVER work for anyone ever again. If I was going to work for a "Jerk" it might as well be me!
2. I would NEVER be and Elder or in a position of "Over Sight" in the organization, the biggest thing I learn at Bethel was, that POWER corrupts people. That I would NEVER sit in judgement of one of my follow brothers/sisters. I think I hold the society's record for the person who was a MS the longest...........over 30 years. Oh Yeah......They wanted to make me an elder a couple of times............I would just skip field service for a month.......that was the end of that.
Anyway, I was going to get married on March 30, 1974. People would ask me if I going to get married as soon as I left Bethel? I would say "NO........I'm waiting 2 weeks." I was hot to trot.
It was Allen Andrews who gave the wedding talk at the Newport R.I Kingdom Hall. I was there with "My Boys" Jack Sutton best man, Roy Baty, Randy Robertson "Country" and Mike Stillman. True to what my future in-laws told me to do "I just showed up." We had the reception at the V.F.W. hall. My father in law Ben Reagan (Gomer Pyle) bragged to everyone at the wedding, that it only cost him $300 bucks for the whole thing. Debbie made her own wedding dress......she wore a ripped pair of panty hose (no cash for new ones). We had a great time and danced our asses off. There was only one problem.........Jim Pipkorn who was to take our wedding pictures (to save money)....... got lost and finally got there and hour before the reception was over........Debbie never did forgive him for that. Debbie and I were the last ones out of the V.F.W. Hall........we just didn't want it to end.
We didn't move to California after the wedding, like I told her parents. There was just too many changes happening. I just couldn't see making four of the biggest changes in my life with in 2 week period 1. Leaving Bethel 2. Getting married 3.moving to California 4. Getting a job. I was tired and exhausted. We had got 1,500 bucks at our wedding, the most money I had ever seen in my whole life. "We were RICH"...........so we played for a whole month. You want to hear something really sick? The only place we went to on our honeymoon was, guess were? That’s right New York City! Since her parents would never let her come down to visit me while we were going together, I wanted to show her the city. At the time you could rent a room in the Towers Hotel from Bethel for cheap......so we went there for a weekend. I must say on some crazy level, I liked the idea of having "legal sex" in a Bethel room. I got some kind of sick pleasure from taking her on a tour of the factory, so I could show off my new bride to all my "Horny" friends.......Who still needed to "make their time"......Kind of a "Hey......Guys, look what I got!....You can get one too.........someday if you’re lucky!"
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My Bthel Experince Part 19 The Last Chapter..(really) Bethel Overseers
by new boy inthere were other people who either killed themselves or tried to kill themselves while they were at "the house of god.
one person who did kill himself was richard wheelock, press room overseer ......he jumped out of a window at the watchtower farm one day.
it seemed, he was never quite the same after his wife "willy" died.
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new boy
Wheres caleb
Don't know your "code talk" but how can you me and SR and a BA at the same time? Not possible. I'm thinking like you were the front runner of BS.
NB
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My Bthel Experince Part 19 The Last Chapter..(really) Bethel Overseers
by new boy inthere were other people who either killed themselves or tried to kill themselves while they were at "the house of god.
one person who did kill himself was richard wheelock, press room overseer ......he jumped out of a window at the watchtower farm one day.
it seemed, he was never quite the same after his wife "willy" died.
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new boy
I didn't know Bob that well. Set on his table for a few months. I just thought he might give me a straight answer. He was one of the few people who I thought were real. But really anyone there in a position would sooner or later start buying into the programing BS. -
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My Bthel Experince Part 19 The Last Chapter..(really) Bethel Overseers
by new boy inthere were other people who either killed themselves or tried to kill themselves while they were at "the house of god.
one person who did kill himself was richard wheelock, press room overseer ......he jumped out of a window at the watchtower farm one day.
it seemed, he was never quite the same after his wife "willy" died.
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new boy
- There were other people who either killed themselves or tried to kill themselves while they were at "the house of God."
One person who did kill himself was Richard Wheelock, Press Room Overseer ......He jumped out of a window at the Watchtower farm one day. It seemed, he was never quite the same after his wife "Willy" died. She seemed to be the only one that he could relate to.......Which would make sense.....because he sure couldn't relate to any of us in the press room..........He would come over to our press and say "Here is the work... get in out".......then just walk away.......He was not the type of person you would really want to talk to anyway......but wouldn't it be nice if just now and then, like every year or two, they might ask you how you were doing?.........You Laugh.......but it’s TRUE......I asked my friend Tom Plank who was the Press Operator of Press # 6 which at the time was one of the three biggest presses at Bethel. He had been in the press room for 4 full years. He told me, that "Brother" Wheelock never once came over to ask him, how he or his family was doing, in 4 years! I didn't care much for “Mr.” Wheelock, he was never really a "brother" to me.
The truth is NONE of my Overseers asked me either! Not in the Laundry, Bindery, Elevator, or the Pressroom. Now I'm sure there were some nice overseers there that did........but I don't know who they were. Even if you worked in a "worldly factory".......I'm sure someone would come over and see how you were doing ever now and then.........But again they would care if you stayed or not.
Oh, they did care about us this one time.......I get this call to come to the bethel office immediately! We were shorthanded at the time in the factory, put I finally got a replacement to work my elevator for me. I showed up at the Bethel office with my roommate Jack Sutton. Our old friends Bob Lang and Curtis Johnson are there. Curtis starts telling us what a "reproach to the organization" our room is, with dirty dishes in the pantry and junk under the beds blah, blah........We listen to him rant for about 10 mins..........That was it!......We did something that you would NEVER do at Bethel...........We defended ourselves! We had had enough, if they wanted to kick us out because are rooms were a mess.......so be it, we didn't care anymore....We told Curtis that if he had a problem with our room why didn't he just come to us like a brother would have, has it says at Matt.18:15. That we Bethelites were hanging on by a thread and we were tired of all this "Nit picking." The whole world was coming apart........and all YOU people cared about was if are rooms are clean enough.” They just set there with their mouths open, with a look of how you dare talk to US that way.
That was it, time to pack our bags............but nothing happen......The only reason they didn't kick us out was because I think they were shorthanded at the time.
It seems everyone in the Witness organization is hung up on what position you are in. "Oh this is brother SO and SO he is a Gilead student.......or he is a Bethelite.........or he is a Pioneer........or he is and Elder........or they are in the Service Department...........or He knows someone that knows someone who was in the Writing Department. They say we are all equal............BULL SHIT........There are more class distinctions in the organization then in the U.S. Army.and you see it in all, in the "house of God" up close.......If you like politics...........you'll fit right in.
A friend of mine from the Press room wanted to leave Bethel before his time was up.......I told him "Ted just leave.......what can they do to you?"......He said "they won't let me pioneer, for 6 months"......."Oh really?" I said......."Do you mean they won't let you go out in field service?"......."No they will." he said....."So they won't let you go in service for a 100 hours a month?"........."NO they will." he said......"Oh" I said "So you can't be CALLED a pioneer"...........God, don't we just love those titles?
There is no fanfare when you leave bethel. Someone buys a 3 dollar box of ice cream at lunch for the whole table and you get a "good bye" card from everyone. The tradition in the press room is they make a handmade card with some jokes about you in it and give it to you.........you shake a few hands and you just leave. No thanks for the 4 years of your life.
I wanted more, I wanted someone in a position of power to tell me something.......Like what the hell was this all about...........So I went to Bob Wallen, he was Knorr’s personal secretary at the time, and he had been one of my table heads in the lower dining room. I really liked Bob and his wife. I said "Bob what was this all about?.............I mean there are somethings going on here that are just not right!".......He said "I know what you mean...........I look at these poor brothers in the bindery.........and I think that there but for the grace of God goes me...........and Keith, I have told the Powers that be, (he motioned into Knorr’s office) that we need to make a FEW changes here..........You, can help us by going back home and telling them how wonderful it is here!"........."What".....I said...Yes he said ...............There is just a year left until 1975 and we really need the help here......So go back home and tell them how great it is here..............or if you can't say anything good about the place......please just keep your mouth shut."
It reminded me of the movie "Catch 22" where they are trying to kill him in the whole movie and then at the end, they tell him he can leave but he must tell them back home how wonderful it is here. They want us to "Just like us!"
Welcome to the Twilight Zone.
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My Bethel Experience Part 18. The last Bethel Tread, Blood Guilt
by new boy inbesides almost getting mugged a couple of times.
his folks had a fit and told him he had to go back and "do his time".........and do the "right thing"...........he told me he had just left max larson’s office, max had just told him “what a disappointment he was, to his family and to the organization!
“do you ever think about james olson?
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new boy
No, the Watchtower Bible and truck society hates press! -
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Why continue to suffer??
by Tigerlove ini occasionally come on this website because i have my eyes on a particular user.
because of that, i end up reading a lot of people's post.
although very interesting and hurt breaking, a lot of them are very strange.
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new boy
It's pretty simple why they stay in messed up relationships. Some people would rather stay with the pain they know as opposed to the pain they don't know. Because of being a witnesses leaving a relationship is a little more costly then in other faiths.
Besides your relationship ending some or all of the following are things you might lose too.
1. The person you're with. Meaning someone will have to screw around or no one can get remarried!
2. Some or ALL your family, because witnesses like to take sides.
3. Some or ALL your friends. Since Witnesses' friends are only at the KH.
4. Some or all your money. As I did when my marriage ended.
So my friend things are a LITTLE more complicated then they look on the surface on the surface of things.
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My Bethel Experience Part 18. The last Bethel Tread, Blood Guilt
by new boy inbesides almost getting mugged a couple of times.
his folks had a fit and told him he had to go back and "do his time".........and do the "right thing"...........he told me he had just left max larson’s office, max had just told him “what a disappointment he was, to his family and to the organization!
“do you ever think about james olson?
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new boy
Besides almost getting mugged a couple of times. The closest, I came to getting hurt while at Bethel was in the summer in 1972, at the Allentown PA District Convention. I think its name was "The Divine Endurance."
After one day of spiritual enlightenment, Jim Pipkorn and I went to this college bar for some beers. There were these kids there that had their whole table top full of these little empty 8 oz. green bottles. They looked, just like little bottles of ginger ale we used to drink as kids.......So after having a few beers myself. I looked over at them......and said......"Hey! What is 'Rolling Rock'? Some kind of soda pop?" These four jocks.....got up and came over to our table and grabbed me, they would have bet the shit out of me, if it wasn't for......Jim saying..."He is just a fool and an idiot, please leave him alone"
The other time was in "Little Italy" in Manhattan. I was with Jim Pipkorn again. There was this really big festival going on there, like in the movie "The Godfather II." Jim and I were sitting in this door way watching everything that was happening. I was looking out at the crowd......and said......"These are MY people (because I'm Italian too)........I love all these old 300 lb. women with moustaches!" Just then I felt this liquid running down my head and all over my clothes. You guessed it. I looked up and saw a big fat Italian Lady with a moustache, pouring her wine glass out on my head. I never saw anyone laugh harder than Jim at that moment. It was me sticking my foot in my month once again.
There was another Jim, I met at Bethel, but I never saw him laugh… ever. It was Jim Olson. I met him on my freight elevator in Factory building # 1 in 1973. He was this sad, shy looking boy, he had blond hair, blue eyes, about 5' 7" He looked like he was only about 16 years old. He was from Kendallville, Indiana and was good friends with "AK Jeff" who posts here on JWD, they had studied together. He was cleaning toilets in the factory. Believe it or not, that is considered a "good job" in the home or factory, because you weren't "on production line" or on one of those damned machines....and no one was on your ass. No overseer to beg to go to the bathroom, but it was a very lonely job. You worked by yourself, there were few people to talk to, all day. He got this job because his family was friends with Max Larson. I probably saw him more than anyone and I didn't have much to say to him either, when you were there for a few years, you just didn't have much to say to the "new boys." They hadn't got it yet.
He got on my elevator one day with tears in his eyes. "What’s up?" I asked. You could tell, he didn't want to tell me, but he did.... he said ........that he couldn't take it anymore at Bethel and about a week earlier, he went back home to Indiana. He was AWOL! He didn’t tell anyone, a big no, no! He told his folks he wanted to come back home for good. His folks had a fit and told him he had to go back and "do his time".........and do the "right thing"...........He told me he had just left Max Larson’s office, Max had just told him “What a disappointment he was, to his family and to the organization!".....So what encouragement did I give this poor kid? Basically NOTHING! I told him. "Hey........Screw them........just do your time......then go home and enjoy the rest of your life." I told him basically the same thing that guy told me, my first day at bethel, which was also his last day. "Do your job and keep your mouth shut. They don't give a shit about you here!"
I didn’t know it at the time but he took off again for home. Again they made him go back. Again Max ripped him a new ass…..
The day he got back to New York was October 31, 1973. I remember that night, because it was Halloween. I was working on my car in the in the garage at the 117 Adams St. building, it was about 9:00 p.m. You could use the garage to work on your car back then, I was changing the oil in my car......when all of a sudden all Hell broke loose. All of the fire alarms went off in Building 4.......The watchmen were running around, trying to find who broke into the factory.....they looked everywhere, but could find nothing. It was very strange. The mystery was solved a few days later.
November 3, 1973 about 12:50 p.m. I'm taking everyone back to work after lunch, on elevator in building one. Everyone is standing on the sky bridges, looking out, at the back of building 4. There is an ambulance there, taking the stiff dead body of some blond hair kid out from behind the bushes surround by trash and beer cans...........it was 19 year old....... Jimmy Olson! He was stiff as a board and dead three days.
I was standing next to Norm Brecky, the ink room overseer. Next to him was Tom Combs, the Job Press overseer. Tom Combs said and I quote "He must have done something REALLY BAD to have killed himself!" Then Norm said and I quote....."I glad he jumped off the BACK of the building and not the front of the building, because we really don't need the extra publicity."
Jimmy was dead and judged on that day.
So my friends......Just who did kill James Olson? Was it the heartless religion? Was it his family? Was it the "Bethel brothers?" Was it Max Larson? I'm the only person who knows who really killed James Olson!
IT WAS ALL OF US!!!
It was the religion, his family, the people in oversight, the bethel family and ME. None of us gave a shit, about this 19 year old kid, James Olson. We all pushed him off the building that night as far as I'm concerned.
P.S.......They DID keep his body.......its buried in some unmarked grave, upstate New York "AK JEFF" told me.
P.S.S......Many years ago a friend of mine sent Max Larson a post card on October 31.....It said. “Do you ever think about James Olson? Hey, we ALL have a resurrection HOPE don't we, right?”
An organization of love would have let this kid go home.
New Boy